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Lane Keeper - Honda Sense vs. Chrysler

14K views 24 replies 17 participants last post by  jerry17 
#1 ·
2018 Honda Odyssey is supposed to have Honda Sense with Lane Keeping, which maintains the car in the center of the lane. Does Chrysler 2017 Pacifica does that, too? Or it just have the Lane Departure Warning and Mitigation?
 
#2 ·
If you get the Advanced SafetyTec option, only available on Touring L Plus and Limited, it will steer you back into the lane if it senses you are going to cross the line on the road. From what I've read, there are two types of these systems out there; one that keeps you centered in the lane and one that has been referred to as "ping-pong." The Pacifica is a ping-pong style, it will steer you back over but it's not guaranteed to keep you centered. It's helpful but doesn't always pick up on the lines on the road if they are not in good shape. I've been on a rather narrow marked rural highway that it did not like. It kept wanting to move you back and forth. Fortunately, it's easy to turn off since there is a button for it on the dash.

I'm not sure about the system on the Honda. I briefly read about other Honda/Acura vehicles that have it and the users weren't entirely impressed. I'm guessing it's a ping-pong style as well but I'm not positive.
 
#4 ·
If you get the Advanced SafetyTec option, only available on Touring L Plus and Limited, it will steer you back into the lane if it senses you are going to cross the line on the road. From what I've read, there are two types of these systems out there; one that keeps you centered in the lane and one that has been referred to as "ping-pong." The Pacifica is a ping-pong style, it will steer you back over but it's not guaranteed to keep you centered. It's helpful but doesn't always pick up on the lines on the road if they are not in good shape. I've been on a rather narrow marked rural highway that it did not like. It kept wanting to move you back and forth. Fortunately, it's easy to turn off since there is a button for it on the dash.



I'm not sure about the system on the Honda. I briefly read about other Honda/Acura vehicles that have it and the users weren't entirely impressed. I'm guessing it's a ping-pong style as well but I'm not positive.


I test drove a Honda CRV with lane keep. It tries to keep you in the center of the lane, but it is not as good as Tesla's AutoPilot. Tesla can turn the wheel much more to keep up with the curvature of highway, where as Honda will give up even for a small curve.

But from what I read, I think Pacifica is a ping pong style so it actually does not try to keep you in the center it. So it is not as current as Honda. Please verify for me. I hope 2018 Pacifica will have this feature.
 
#3 ·
Per Wikipedia...Lane keeping assist mechanism can either reactively turn a vehicle back into the lane if it starts to leave or proactively keep the vehicle in the center of the lane. Vehicle companies often use the term "Lane Keep(ing) Assist" to refer to both reactive Lane Keep Assist (LKA) and proactive Lane Centering Assist (LCA) but the terms are beginning to be differentiated.

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#5 ·
I test drove a Honda Pilot with Lane Keeping Assist. It is similar to what it sounds like Chrysler's setup is. It doesn't keep you centred in the lane, it reacts to drifting towards either side of the lane, pulling you back in and giving a warning to grab the wheel. It's not designed to always keep you in the lane, it's just an added help along with the lane departure warning. If you are on a large curve, it won't mitigate it fully as it is only using torque adjustments to the steering to try to keep the vehicle in the lane.
 
#6 ·
So essentially these systems are crap. It's hard for me to use an autonomous driver assist system if it's less than perfect.


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#11 ·
As others have said, these things in the Odyssey and Pacifica are in no way, shape or form intended or advertised to be fully autonomous. They are just additional safety nets to maybe keep you from getting in an accident. Tesla has the closest thing to being fully autonomous but it still requires driver attention and intervention.
 
#7 ·
I don't think it's crap. It's an assist that you shouldn't need or rely on if you are paying attention. For those times that you are distracted it could help so long as it can read the lines on the road. Its going to take years for the rest of the auto industry to catch up to tesla. If only they ditched the model x and made an actual minivan at a reasonable price..
 
#8 ·
All of the current systems are less than perfect. There are no true autonomous cars available to consumers at this point, including Teslas. You're still supposed to keep your hands on the wheel.
It's all driver assist, designed to make you a better driver, rather than to do the driving for you.
 
#10 ·
I am going to miss Autopilot (AP v1), aka Mobile Eye system, when I return my 7 month old Model X next week. It is very nice for traffic and highway. You have to lightly torque the steering wheel using your hand about every minute or two, and it is not fully autonomous, but it is amazing how restful it is to allow the system to do most of the boring work, freeing you for higher level attention tasks (what might that driver ahead be about to do, etc). I will be getting AP v2 in the Model 3, but so far it seems that one is well behind AP v1. It will be interesting to see if and how other manufacturers integrate Mobile Eye (now separated from Tesla) into some new cars.
 
#12 ·
I wish they would put more tech in to help people pay greater attention to their driving instead of features that entice folks to futz with their cell phones more.
 
#19 ·
I've been wondering if this ping-pong effect is a hardware/software limitation or just the manufacturer's idea of limiting liability by keeping us engaged in the steering. I do use LKA a lot as well as ACC and I feel both keep me safer and more relaxed.

The current LKA system certainly could be better, the ping-pong effect is a bit annoying as it feels like the car is steering by only looking a few hundred feet down the road like a beginning driver and often lets the vehicle drift to the lane edge. If the lane sensors are not good enough they need to be upgraded, else the software should be upgraded. It really feels like more of a software issue to me as 1). There is quite a wide wobble range before LKA will harden up the steering or bump me back and 2). My LKA system seems too generous with where true center is and favors a position more left of center than I would choose.
 
#25 ·
I keep referring to it as LKA, but it is not, it is "LaneSense" and the name itself implies the limits of the system (no "keeping")

Page 408 of the 2017 Owners Manual:
LaneSense Operation
The LaneSense system is operational at speeds above 37 mph (60 km/h) and below 112 mph (180 km/h). It uses a forward looking camera to detect lane markings and measure vehicle position within the lane boundaries.

When both lane markings are detected and the driver unintentionally drifts out of the lane (no turn signal applied), the LaneSense system provides a haptic warning in the form of torque applied to the steering wheel to prompt the driver to remain within the lane boundaries.

The LaneSense system will also provide a visual warning through the instrument cluster display to prompt the driver to remain within the lane boundaries.
The driver may manually override the haptic warning by applying torque into the steering wheel at any time.

When only a single lane marking is detected and the driver unintentionally drifts across that lane marking (no turn signal applied), the LaneSense system provides a visual warning through the instrument cluster display to prompt the driver to remain within the lane. When only a single lane marking is detected, a haptic (torque) warning will not be provided.

NOTE: When operating conditions have been met, the LaneSense system will monitor if the driver’s hands are on the steering wheel and provides an audible and visual warning to the driver when the driver’s hands are not detected on the steering wheel. The system will cancel if the driver does not return their hands to the wheel.


Page 232 of the 2017 Users Manual:
LaneSense Indicator Light
This light will appear either white, yellow, or green in the instrument cluster.Depending on which color it appears, it could mean one of the following:
• White — The LaneSense Indicator Light turns on and is white when the LaneSense system is on, and none, or only the left, or right, lane marking has been detected.
• Yellow — The LaneSense Indicator Light turns yellow when the LaneSense system is on, and has detected a lane drift situation. It will begin to flash when the system sense the lane has been approached and the vehicle is in a lane departure situation.
• Green — The LaneSense Indicator Light turns green when the LaneSense system is on, both lane markings have been detected


So the Pacifica will, within limits, nudge you back from the line. It will make no further effort to keep you in the lane unless you drift over to one side again. So "ping pong" scenarios can develop.

As noted above, the more "assists" we get while driving, the more likely it is our attention will wander or be easily distracted ("what's the title of the song on the radio?")

If you saw the video of the Uber incident that killed the woman with a bike, the backup dirver was looking in their lap.

When I worked in the railroad industry many years ago, one of the challenges was devising what are called "dead man" systems to detect when a locomotive engineer is not paying attention, possibly due to a medical incident. Unlike some of the systems used in subway systems, which require pressure on a throttle handle and which the operator can rest at station stops, these systems were designed to allow some freedom since the train can go hours without a stop -- requiring a touch or other action at a time interval after it detected a "hands off" situation. The locomotive engineers were often just as ingenious in finding ways to get around the deadman systerm -- investigations find that root cause of many accidents in all industries are users working very hard to defeat the safety systems. Read on another thread how someone figured out how to power open the sliding doors while still moving.

Until we get to true self-driving cars, we are going to be in this dangerous zone where driver assist systems lead to attention fatigue for the average driver.
 
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