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2021 Pacifica Touring S(gas), Ceramic Gray, Black-out accents, sharp!
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Tues, 9/20/22, 915am; So I sit in a servicing, authorized Chrysler dealer right now... 15k miles on my new 2021 Pacifica, in for first tire rotation... these are the open-ended, (wheel lug stud showing), high-security McGard FACTORY INSTALLED locks with the spinning collar. Never been off the vehicle, and confirmed via on the Monterey label as FACTORY installed. first lock off. Second lock ended up breaking the aluminum key teeth. Ordered replacement key from McGard, at my cost, brought van in to dealer for removal of these last to locks that I cannot budge, and a tire rotation, the first tire rotation and what would be the first time the lugs are removed from new van delivery.

Dealer CANNOT remove the 2 seized wheel locks via regular methods. They have now indicated the clock/shop time continues... and have now confirmed, front wheel (rim) damage HAS occurred as they attempt to remove the seized locking lugs via force methods. Rear wheel proving even more difficult that front, stud is broke, still locked on, and now they tell me they will have to torch from inside of wheel, causing more wheel/rim damage. I'm on the phone with Chrysler, have a case #... Chrysler simply insists the van is under warranty, dealer says, issue is seized parts not covered, for they will be expecting payment for their services today, and I'll leave with damaged rims... everything points that this will be on my dime...

I say, you'll see me on the local news tonight with one of the local news story advocates.

Come on guys, this is not that difficult... someone needs to stand up here and do the right thing, call the dealer, get communicating, and make this right to the consumer.

To say this has been nothing but a disappointing experience is an understatement.

@ChrylserCares , care to chime in here?
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
I should add, these locking lugs, on the McGard site, appear to come with black plastic 'caps', NONE of which were ever on any wheel of my van, I'm betting not on your van either...

and this mention right on their website:
"
Wheel Locks for cone seat steel or aluminum wheels with wheel covers, center caps or hub caps covering the lug nuts. Low profile eliminates height clearance problems. Dual hex wheel lock keys fit 3/4″, 13/16″, 19mm & 21mm lug wrenches. May also be used for exposed applications with optional black or chrome nylon caps.
*No caps available for kits 24014, 24015, 24016, 24019 & 24024. 24019 uses customers’ OEM caps.

My guess here, these were improperly installed with incorrect torque at the factory, and with my mid-west winter elements, the seizing happened. In any event, I am not to blame here, and ALL this should be warranty covered.
 

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Dealer installed option , lug nuts that are locking are not installed at factory level . Odds are nuts we’re put on with a impact gun and as such with weather are showing this condition . Unfortunately there’s nothing you can do but drill out the studs and replace , moving forward lug nuts have a torque setting and you can also put a touch of grease to minimize hard seating .
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I respectfully disagree with you, Canadahybridguy, just confirmed with the service manager, PACS where these locks are ONE the label come FACTORY INSTLLED, not at dealer.
I'd have loved it of they could simply have 'drilled' them out as easily as you seem to think... but alas, I am the one here, and THEY are the factory authorized service folks, and despite your training, they had to use an acetylene torch o one to burn it out...
Here are pictures of my "new" Pacifica wheels after. Chrysler owes me 2 new wheels.
 

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Do you have a pic of the window sticker of your vehicle ? . The lug nuts are oem yes , the shallow shank open end mcguard nut isn’t factory . And what’s your in service and mileage on the vehicle ? . Unfortunately nut runnners at factory level do not install these open ended locking nuts . Factory lug nuts are the silver ones yes that you posted in pic. I don’t know your vin for n service , mileage , etc so I can only reply with the info you gave . Is this the dealer you purchased the vehicle from also ?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Canadahybridguy; Today was a bad enough day already at the dealer... I am done debating you. You know so much, perhaps you can be helpful and take care of this reimbursement for me? What you attached is NOT my brochure. And yes, i do have a pic of the window sticker, and it specifically says locking lug-nuts. The servicing dealer, service manager confirmed to me today, in person, Pacifica's with these open ended McGard high security locks, with the spinning collar come directly from the factory, installed. I fail to see how me giving you my VIN will prove me helpful from you, you only seem to be defiant against anyone finding any fault with a complaint against Chrysler, at least that has been my experience... In service on a new, dealer purchased 2021 was Mar 30, 2021. Service for the brutal removal of these seized nuts today, causing the damage to my wheels was 15,194 miles. Service dealer today was not the selling dealer, due to location being appx. 150 miles away... can you imagine taking that trip, getting a flat and not having the equipment an authorized Chrysler dealer had (on the side of the road, including an acetylene torch, and not just one to break, but 2 OEM McGard wheel lock keys, with ohh so strong aluminum construction) , that did this much damage and took this much brute force to remove OEM installed lugs. On a vehicle in service for a whopping 18 months.

I realize everyone has a right to say what they want here, and almost anywhere, but I fail to see any help in your line of response. To that end, call me rude if you will, but I am done defending myself to you, hope you do have a good day though... and hope nothing adverse happens to your Chrysler. Font Material property Parallel Document Number
 

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Canadahybridguy; Today was a bad enough day already at the dealer... I am done debating you. You know so much, perhaps you can be helpful and take care of this reimbursement for me? What you attached is NOT my brochure. And yes, i do have a pic of the window sticker, and it specifically says locking lug-nuts. The servicing dealer, service manager confirmed to me today, in person, Pacifica's with these open ended McGard high security locks, with the spinning collar come directly from the factory, installed. I fail to see how me giving you my VIN will prove me helpful from you, you only seem to be defiant against anyone finding any fault with a complaint against Chrysler, at least that has been my experience... In service on a new, dealer purchased 2021 was Mar 30, 2021. Service for the brutal removal of these seized nuts today, causing the damage to my wheels was 15,194 miles. Service dealer today was not the selling dealer, due to location being appx. 150 miles away... can you imagine taking that trip, getting a flat and not having the equipment an authorized Chrysler dealer had (on the side of the road, including an acetylene torch, and not just one to break, but 2 OEM McGard wheel lock keys, with ohh so strong aluminum construction) , that did this much damage and took this much brute force to remove OEM installed lugs. On a vehicle in service for a whopping 18 months.

I realize everyone has a right to say what they want here, and almost anywhere, but I fail to see any help in your line of response. To that end, call me rude if you will, but I am done defending myself to you, hope you do have a good day though... and hope nothing adverse happens to your Chrysler. View attachment 51157
I'm not sure how it works for Chrysler, but I know from firsthand experience (I work at a GM dealership) that wheel locks for all GM products are installed at the dealership. This includes all brand new vehicles that were ordered with them and those that were sold as a dealer add-on. I wouldn't know without calling a Chrysler dealership, but there is a high probability that the same is true for Chrysler products. I agree with @CANADAHYBRIDGUY that nothing on your window sticker confirms they were in fact installed at the factory. It simply confirms that the vehicle was ordered with them.

I'm sorry that your having a tough time getting this resolved. I don't think anyone can blame you for being upset.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I'm not sure how it works for Chrysler, but I know from firsthand experience (I work at a GM dealership) that wheel locks for all GM products are installed at the dealership. This includes all brand new vehicles that were ordered with them and those that were sold as a dealer add-on. I wouldn't know without calling a Chrysler dealership, but there is a high probability that the same is true for Chrysler products. I agree with @CANADAHYBRIDGUY that nothing on your window sticker confirms they were in fact installed at the factory. It simply confirms that the vehicle was ordered with them.

I'm sorry that your having a tough time getting this resolved. I don't think anyone can blame you for being upset.
Thank you Freddie.. I'll update how this goes... I just hope Chrysler steps up and does the right thing here, and in the process, maybe get a definitive answer as to where these installed at the factory or at the dealer... but in any event, this will be on my dime. I honestly can understand how some folks snap at a situation like this... I don't care who makes good on this, the selling dealer if they indeed installed them, or Chrysler if they were done at the factory. All I know is this was NOT my doing, and I will not settle, quietly for this outcome, the look of my van is horribly blemished by this, and, well, I am sick over the whole experience.
 

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I have to believe a competent, busy tire shop would know how to get locking nuts off without a key, and without destroying the wheel in the process.
I would have expected you would need new lugs pressed in, but not new wheels, and not an exorbitant labor charge.
 
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This is the so common in the auto sector , improperly installed lug nuts . Should hand start the nut , as to not cross thread the stud , tire should be off the ground so the load isn’t on the studs, nuts should be then torqued using a click wrench or torque bar at recommend setting . Then after about a day or two should be further checked again . Torquing pattern is basically in a star pattern to allow for even rim load against the hub .
 

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This is the so common in the auto sector , improperly installed lug nuts . Should hand start the nut , as to not cross thread the stud , tire should be off the ground so the load isn’t on the studs, nuts should be then torqued using a click wrench or torque bar at recommend setting . Then after about a day or two should be further checked again . Torquing pattern is basically in a star pattern to allow for even rim load against the hub .
This is so true, My Grandfather taught me impacts were for removing nuts and bolts by the time I was 10 I knew how to start lug nuts by hand an use the German torque spec. - Gutentight.
 

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We can all debate whether or not these are or should be factory installed but ultimately it does not matter. It is an installed option that is covered under the new car warranty, whether it was installed incorrectly, faulty or otherwise should make no difference to that point. If the option was installed incorrectly at the dealer that sold the car then that is something that Chrysler needs to take up, either way the work should be covered under the new car warranty unless Chrysler can show that the parts in question were damaged by something that someone else did.
 

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The parts are not defective , the problem here is that one year has passed and they will raise the “ timeline “ conversation . So trying to tell the forum member that moving parts are covered but has past the timeline is just making sure he has the info . The manufacturer will ultimately point to the dealership , the dealership will negate the blame due to the time frame from in service to the time line of service . This isn’t the first circumstance of this nature , everything to do with warranties , defects , wear and tear are all listed in warranty in owners manual . It’s too bad that he didn’t do a tire rotation within 6 month time frame .
 

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I feel for you as I have always had my local dealer over tighten the lugs nuts every time they do anything with the wheels or tires. I would keep working with Chrysler customer service to get a better resolution for your lug nut issue. I had the locking lug nuts come on my 2017 Limited and I took them off and replaced them with another lug nut. I have even resorted to calling the service manager to have them retorque the lug nuts properly. I have a torque wrench I take with me to verify in the service lane. First flat and you cannot take the wheel off will piss anyone off. Let us know how you get it resolved.
 

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My tire dealer had a special wrench that could remove locking lug nuts even if the “key” is lost. Make some phone calls to tire dealers.
There are a few commonly used patterns for which a tire shop usually has a corresponding socket for, but there's no special wrench that works on all of them. If such a tool existed it would defeat the purpose altogether. :)
 

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When I worked at a tire store in college, 45 years ago, locking lug nuts were called "puzzle locks." There were several different patterns. We didn't have the masters for all of them, but we did for several. The owner of the shop was adamant about brushing a small amount of anti-sieze compound on the lug threads to prevent the lugnuts from rusting or galling in place. He was really insistent when puzzle locks were involved because they were miserably difficult to remove when they got stuck or over-torqued. We also were told to use the torque wrench he had for that purpose when installing the wheels.

It's important to be careful not to over-torque, even with a torque wrench, when anti-sieze compound is used on the threads. It's a good lubricant and makes over-torquing easy.
 
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Is there a picture of the "factory wheel locks" here @2021 Sport Pac Guy ?

The locks are installed by the dealer & should look like this:



Now if you didn't have those style locks on your van, you need to be going back to (and also blaming) your original selling dealer asking why they didn't install the MOPAR locks.
 
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