TIme and a minimum of four gallons filling the tank to reset the timer before FORM is activated. The info is in your user manual.
Fuel-Oil Refresh Mode operation
2019 Touring L Hybrid-Canadian version
Does anybody know what the vehicle system is monitoring to trigger the Engine-Oil Refresh (constant gas operation) mode? I travel fairly short city distances and try to keep on electric as much as possible. Is it the miles/km driven while in electric mode or number of full charges that trigger it? When it goes into that mode I have to burn about a 1/4 tank and then tank up to switch it back to electric drive only.
-Hybriddy in Vancouver BC Canada
Does anybody know what the vehicle system is monitoring to trigger the Engine-Oil Refresh (constant gas operation) mode? I travel fairly short city distances and try to keep on electric as much as possible. Is it the miles/km driven while in electric mode or number of full charges that trigger it? When it goes into that mode I have to burn about a 1/4 tank and then tank up to switch it back to electric drive only.
-Hybriddy in Vancouver BC Canada
1 - 20 of 54 Posts
My understanding is that it will use mileage as a barometer to initiate fuel oil refresh . The longer you travel on electric and zero or less engine you use it will then engage oil refresh . A specific mileage number I’m not sure . I think that’s why if your using vast majority of electric to not keep tank full past 1/4 to half. . But it will drain the tank and also lubricate the engine at same time .
The info is in your user manual. I have never had FORM activate on my hybrid since owning it. As I add fuel anytime it is a quarter of a tank below full. Unless on a long trip I let it run all the way down near empty.
Fuel And Oil Refresh Mode
Since it is possible to operate this vehicle for extended
periods of time without running the gas engine, the fuel
within the vehicle’s fuel tank can become stale. To prevent
engine and/or fuel system damage due to stale fuel, as
well as, maintaining internal engine lubrication, this vehicle
is equipped with a “Fuel and Oil Refresh Mode”.
The vehicle will automatically enter into the Fuel and Oil
Refresh Mode to minimize potential for stale fuel, and to
ensure lubrication of internal engine components. When
operating in this mode, the gas engine will run to provide
vehicle propulsion (electric only operation is inhibited). A
message will be displayed in the instrument cluster whenever
Fuel and Oil Refresh Mode is active.
The vehicle will automatically exit the Fuel and Oil Refresh
Mode when conditions have been satisfied. If the vehicle
enters Fuel and Oil Refresh Mode, due to fuel which has
been in the fuel tank for a long period of time (becoming
stale fuel), the engine will run whenever the vehicle is
operational (no electric only operation) until the low fuel
level warning is activated. It is possible to exit the Fuel and
Oil Refresh Mode sooner by adding four gallons or more of new fuel to the
vehicle’s fuel tank.
Fuel And Oil Refresh Mode
Since it is possible to operate this vehicle for extended
periods of time without running the gas engine, the fuel
within the vehicle’s fuel tank can become stale. To prevent
engine and/or fuel system damage due to stale fuel, as
well as, maintaining internal engine lubrication, this vehicle
is equipped with a “Fuel and Oil Refresh Mode”.
The vehicle will automatically enter into the Fuel and Oil
Refresh Mode to minimize potential for stale fuel, and to
ensure lubrication of internal engine components. When
operating in this mode, the gas engine will run to provide
vehicle propulsion (electric only operation is inhibited). A
message will be displayed in the instrument cluster whenever
Fuel and Oil Refresh Mode is active.
The vehicle will automatically exit the Fuel and Oil Refresh
Mode when conditions have been satisfied. If the vehicle
enters Fuel and Oil Refresh Mode, due to fuel which has
been in the fuel tank for a long period of time (becoming
stale fuel), the engine will run whenever the vehicle is
operational (no electric only operation) until the low fuel
level warning is activated. It is possible to exit the Fuel and
Oil Refresh Mode sooner by adding four gallons or more of new fuel to the
vehicle’s fuel tank.
I just have a can, and add about 3 US gallons to stop FORM. I find I get through the fuel by the time FORM comes in again. I wish there was a option to pause it for a week or so.
Thanks to those answers. My two redundant postings was premature. Newbie to this forum and I didn't do a thorough search nor I didn't RTFM! I unfortunately gave up on relying finding pertinent details in much of the large but IMHO poorly written manual. Whole pages within important operation topics revert to 'If Equipped' sections. The build sheet from my dealer doesn't even mention some of the more esoteric comfort and safety 'features' mentioned.My understanding is that it will use mileage as a barometer to initiate fuel oil refresh . The longer you travel on electric and zero or less engine you use it will then engage oil refresh . A specific mileage number I’m not sure . I think that’s why if your using vast majority of electric to not keep tank full past 1/4 to half. . But it will drain the tank and also lubricate the engine at same time .
I just quoted the user manual for you. Fill the tank if you want it to stop. Only putting enough fuel in to keep it at or below 1/4 a tank will never stop as it is not the four-gallon minimum requirement to reset the timer.Thanks to those answers. My two redundant postings was premature. Newbie to this forum and I didn't do a thorough search nor I didn't RTFM! I unfortunately gave up on relying finding pertinent details in much of the large but IMHO poorly written manual. Whole pages within important operation topics revert to 'If Equipped' sections. The build sheet from my dealer doesn't even mention some of the more esoteric comfort and safety 'features' mentioned.
I think an owners typical trip cycle use has a lot to do the frequency of FROM occurring as well; . so if you rarely to down to <1 on the battery level where the system kicks into its true hybrid mode and the engine is engaged running briefly to charge and the maintain battery back up to at least the <1 above absolute discharge then the FORM will come one much more frequently over the months. So its a combination of trip use, battery exhaustion cycling and time.
The only question that still bugs me with this engine design and application on these Hybrids is that by comparison, I used to let my old '95 Toyota Avalon (fantastic build quality and longevity on that one!) sit for a month or more, did not too frequent oil changes and never used fuel additives even here in Southern Canada in a only moderately cold winter climate, and never had a hint of engine trouble over 22 years, other than the two oxygen sensors which I replaced myself and a water pump replacement. My Odyssey which was a '99 EX model also had periods of no use and other than a the infamous EGR port clogging also never had any engine problems.
As mentioned in this description by Allpar in Deep inside the Chrysler Pacifica hybrid system which describes the overall technical design of the Chrysler Hybrid system:
"The gasoline engine is also different; it uses the Atkinson cycle (like Toyota hybrids), which is more efficient but produces lower peak power. There is no exhaust gas circulation (EGR) or alternator; and the air conditioner is not driven directly by the engine (so it can be powered when running on full electric). Internally, changes including different camshafts, pistons, and spark plugs; the oil pan and intake are also different from the non-hybrid version."
-So can the different camshafts, pistons, spark plugs, oil pan and air intake system be much more sensitive to engine killing effects of stale fuel, stale oil and internal condensation than a garden variety ICE?
My theory is that Chrysler thinks so (based on computer modelling, destructive or real world testing or ??) so hence the programmed FROM to run the engine in gas only mode.
The only question that still bugs me with this engine design and application on these Hybrids is that by comparison, I used to let my old '95 Toyota Avalon (fantastic build quality and longevity on that one!) sit for a month or more, did not too frequent oil changes and never used fuel additives even here in Southern Canada in a only moderately cold winter climate, and never had a hint of engine trouble over 22 years, other than the two oxygen sensors which I replaced myself and a water pump replacement. My Odyssey which was a '99 EX model also had periods of no use and other than a the infamous EGR port clogging also never had any engine problems.
As mentioned in this description by Allpar in Deep inside the Chrysler Pacifica hybrid system which describes the overall technical design of the Chrysler Hybrid system:
"The gasoline engine is also different; it uses the Atkinson cycle (like Toyota hybrids), which is more efficient but produces lower peak power. There is no exhaust gas circulation (EGR) or alternator; and the air conditioner is not driven directly by the engine (so it can be powered when running on full electric). Internally, changes including different camshafts, pistons, and spark plugs; the oil pan and intake are also different from the non-hybrid version."
-So can the different camshafts, pistons, spark plugs, oil pan and air intake system be much more sensitive to engine killing effects of stale fuel, stale oil and internal condensation than a garden variety ICE?
My theory is that Chrysler thinks so (based on computer modelling, destructive or real world testing or ??) so hence the programmed FROM to run the engine in gas only mode.
I just purchased brand new 2021 and it was sitting at the mall for display for 3 months. Dealer came to deliver 3 hours away and engine never turned off ( ehybrid all said it was all engine all the way). They put about 7 gallon in ) FORM is still on. Could it be oil now? Oil life says 67 %. The car has been driven only 236 miles
Very frustrating
Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk
Very frustrating
Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk
I would put in 3 or 4 gallons of fuel and see if it goes offI just purchased brand new 2021 and it was sitting at the mall for display for 3 months. Dealer came to deliver 3 hours away and engine never turned off ( ehybrid all said it was all engine all the way). They put about 7 gallon in ) FORM is still on. Could it be oil now? Oil life says 67 %. The car has been driven only 236 miles
Very frustrating
Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk
Thank you I did and it went away. Surprised that it didn't go away when dealer filled it up.I would put in 3 or 4 gallons of fuel and see if it goes off
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This is frustrating to me because I also own a 2012 volt which has a similar protective feature to FORM, but it will only come on if you haven't used the ICE in several months and it only runs it for about five minutes while the screen provides a % completed bar. It doesn't require you to add fresh gas at all. I'm wondering if it's pressurized fuel tank helps keep the fuel fresh longer? I almost never add fuel to that vehicle and have not had significant issues with the engine. In our use case both vehicles are almost exclusively EVs except for road trips, so this FORM mode is kinda annoying.
There is a very detailed discussion of it here: Oil refresh mode - analysis and solutions
TL;DR: If adding fuel doesn't help, drive for 10 min to warm up the engine and drain the battery a bit, then idle in your driveway for another 5-15 min, which will let the oil heat up past 100 degrees Celsius. That should exit the mode. There are two things that can trigger FORM, stale gas, or the computer believing that there might be condensation in the oil (which it then wants to boil off). Just driving doesn't usually allow the oil to get hot enough because of the air passing through the radiator, so the idling is key.
TL;DR: If adding fuel doesn't help, drive for 10 min to warm up the engine and drain the battery a bit, then idle in your driveway for another 5-15 min, which will let the oil heat up past 100 degrees Celsius. That should exit the mode. There are two things that can trigger FORM, stale gas, or the computer believing that there might be condensation in the oil (which it then wants to boil off). Just driving doesn't usually allow the oil to get hot enough because of the air passing through the radiator, so the idling is key.
The Oil mode also tracks oil dilution due to blow by from the engine running but the oil not reaching normal temperature. I just had form for the first time on my 2021 Hybrid. The tank had been filled about a month ago so I figured it must have been oil related. So I put the fam in the van, loaded up on snacks and went for a 30 minute drive. That fixed it.There is a very detailed discussion of it here: Oil refresh mode - analysis and solutions
TL;DR: If adding fuel doesn't help, drive for 10 min to warm up the engine and drain the battery a bit, then idle in your driveway for another 5-15 min, which will let the oil heat up past 100 degrees Celsius. That should exit the mode. There are two things that can trigger FORM, stale gas, or the computer believing that there might be condensation in the oil (which it then wants to boil off). Just driving doesn't usually allow the oil to get hot enough because of the air passing through the radiator, so the idling is key.
Interesting! On my 2017 it only went off after I idled it for a while. That was in the winter too, might be different if it was warmer outside.So I put the fam in the van, loaded up on snacks and went for a 30 minute drive. That fixed it.
Ya the earlier Hybrids seemed to have issues getting the oil hot enough in the winter to satisfy an oil refresh. I think you need to get the oil over 80C for 15-20 minutes. My 2021 oil temperature would go that high at highway speed even at -30C. So they must have changed something with the later models.Interesting! On my 2017 it only went off after I idled it for a while. That was in the winter too, might be different if it was warmer outside.
Pretty sure the service manual states refueling the vehicle will not change FORM status. Resetting the oil change light will but it's expressly stated -not- to do that. The idea is to get the juices flowing in the engine and burn out the tank to prevent stale fuel. Really should just let it go until it finishes itself. Trying to bypass it really doesn't make sense.
2021 Hybrid Supplement page 37:Pretty sure the service manual states refueling the vehicle will not change FORM status. Resetting the oil change light will but it's expressly stated -not- to do that. The idea is to get the juices flowing in the engine and burn out the tank to prevent stale fuel. Really should just let it go until it finishes itself. Trying to bypass it really doesn't make sense.
”If the vehicle enters Fuel and Oil Refresh Mode, due to fuel which has been in the fuel tank for a long period of time (becoming stale fuel), the engine will run whenever the vehicle is operational (no electric only operation) until the low fuel level warning is activated. It is also possible to exit the Fuel and Oil Refresh Mode sooner by adding a minimum of four gallons of new fuel to the vehicle’s fuel tank.”
I think the key word is "possible" there. I've seen reports of people adding plenty of fuel and it doesn't leave FORM. I believe it's also to condition the oil in addition to the fuel?2021 Hybrid Supplement page 37:
”If the vehicle enters Fuel and Oil Refresh Mode, due to fuel which has been in the fuel tank for a long period of time (becoming stale fuel), the engine will run whenever the vehicle is operational (no electric only operation) until the low fuel level warning is activated. It is also possible to exit the Fuel and Oil Refresh Mode sooner by adding a minimum of four gallons of new fuel to the vehicle’s fuel tank.”
Yes it’s there for fuel, oil, and apparently spark plugs as well. But FORM can trigger for any or all of the conditions. It would be nice if it told us why it was activating. I just had it for oil. The fuel in the tank was at 3/4 full and only about 1 month old, and FORM started, so I figured it must be oil. We drove enough to bring the oil over 80C, then another 15-20 minutes of driving and FORM ended. Probably the best strategy to get out of FORM when it activates is to immediately add 5 gallons/19 L to the tank. (I say add a little more than required to account for measurement inaccuracy) If that doesn’t end FORM you can assume it’s oil based and you need to get the oil up to 80C or so and keep it there for 15-20 minutes. That can apparently be tricky in very cold weather for pre-2021 models. My 2021 never had a problem warming up even in very cold weather.I think the key word is "possible" there. I've seen reports of people adding plenty of fuel and it doesn't leave FORM. I believe it's also to condition the oil in addition to the fuel?
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