[Big D]

I just traded in my 2018 Toyota Highlander Limited for a 2020 Pacifica Hybrid Limited. Almost bought a 2018 Highlander Hybrid but did not like the price and the way the vehicle drove (plus no tax incentives). I can say the build quality of the Highlander was outstanding, no complaints there. A few design issues, visibility around the outside mirrors was horrible, could not see over or under them when turning (bounced over curbs and medians a few times. The adaptive cruise was agonizingly slow reacting to traffic, steering was vague and tended to wander when you weren't paying attention, and the front seats were hard to get in and out of. All in all, a solid well made SUV with a few annoying quirks. I drove a 2020 Highlander Limited before purchasing my Pacifica and it drove better than the 18 model, mirrors were slightly better so there were improvements made. At that point I had really decided it was time to get a Hybrid and decided to concentrate on the Pacifica.
I first drove a 2020 Pacifica Limited gas model and was impressed with the driveability. It drove a lot like the 2020 Highlander, same get up and go, comparable noise level. I did feel the build quality was not quite as good, but the design and usability was better, a lot of the features worked better (Uconnect, Stow and go, interior storage and room).
When I finally located a new Pacifica Hybrid and got to drive it I was really impressed, it has more get up and go than the gas model, very smooth power and very quiet even when the engine runs. I think it rides better than the gas model, probably due to the weight increase. It handles very well for a van, the seats are comfortable, visibility is really good, and technology is top notch.
Comparing the Highlander to the Pacifica - The Highlander had some annoyances but the build quality was great, the usability and convenience was typical SUV. I liked it but did not love it.
The Pacifica, on the other hand, great design, great usability and space, impressive technology, build quality very good. I love it so far (especially those Hybrid tax incentives), hope I feel the same way 2 years down the road.

 

[SWPacLim]

Oh, man. Even when prices come down you should check what people are complaining about regarding the Palisade (and Telluride) on the Safecar website. Highly recommend waiting another year (at least!) to sort the problems or you'll end up bitterly complaining on the Palisade user forum like you are on this one. Just sayin', there's a reason why lots of folks avoid buying first and second production years of new model vehicles.

I read the forums and all. I have every confidence that a Palisade will be better than my Pacifica. In any event the Pacifica lease isn't up until November so it would be a 2021 model.

This is an apples and oranges decision. Why be so concerned about 2017 Pacifica Job 1 release bugs fully-ironed out 3 yrs ago, then select a 2020 SUV which is untested and functionally “entirely different”? Why compare a $20k used 2017 Pacifica to a smaller SUV costing 2x or more? I’d have to dispute your ride and comfort comparison claims, as it’s clear you did not do an A to B comparison. The Pacifica is known for offering #1 market-leading ride quality and comfort in the segment, definitely superior to any truck-based SUV.

Not sure who you're directing this towards. The OP was deciding between a Pacifica and Toyota Sienna. That is absolutely an apples to apples comparison, and comparing a minivan to a 3 row crossover is not exactly an apples to oranges comparison, its a comparison most consumers for this sort of vehicle make as those are quite commonly cross-shopped,

If its me, as for comparing a "$20k used Pacifica to a smaller SUV costing 2x more" who is doing that? My Pacifica was leased new, and will be replaced with a vehicle of similar original cost also purchased or leased new. The 2017 Pacifica is largely the same as a 2020 Pacifica, and the MSRP on the loaded Palisade is less than the MSRP on my Pacifica.

As for my ride quality comparison claims, I own a Pacifica. So yes, it was a A to B comparison. I don't find my Pacifica to ride particularly well (it doesnt ride poorly, the ride is just not a standout feature) , certainly no better than a Sienna or Odyssey. The Palisade is also not a truck based SUV, its a unibody crossover, same as the Pacifica. Unlike the Pacifica, I felt the ride of the Palisade was a standout feature for it.

Have you driven a Palisade? My guess is no, so how can you refute my opinion of its ride vs the Pacifica?

hope I feel the same way 2 years down the road.

Thats going to be the question...

 

[orangeandwhite]

For what it’s worth, the Pacifica is very precisely targeted on the needs of a family.

Today’s experience ... I just spent a while cleaning up my kid’s carsick incident. It was really remarkable how impervious the interior materials were to vomit, which must have been a specific design objective they worked to. The carpet, plastic trims, even the seat material - a healthy dose of all-purpose cleaner and a bit of elbow grease and it came out readily.

Having done this before in other cars, where the materials were clearly not intended to be cleaned nonprofessionally, it was a remarkably positive surprise.

 

[orangeandwhite]

For what it’s worth, the Pacifica is very precisely targeted on the needs of a family.

Today’s experience ... I just spent a while cleaning up my kid’s carsick incident. It was really remarkable how impervious the interior materials were to vomit, which must have been a specific design objective they worked to. The carpet, plastic trims, even the seat material - a healthy dose of all-purpose cleaner and a bit of elbow grease and it came out readily.

Having done this before in other cars, where the materials were clearly not intended to be cleaned nonprofessionally, it was a remarkably positive surprise.

 

[SWPacLim]

No question about that. The only issue Ive had in that regard is the carpeting, which at least in the 2017 is very grabby and hard to vacuum out lint or hair or anything like that.

 

[Rfalcon]

OP

We just ordered the Pac after test driving all the similar priced minivans. Our priorities were seat comfort, seat height, acceleration, ride comfort and interior room/height. We chose it over the Sienna due to comfort and overall riding height: seats seem to sit a bit higher (from the ground) in the PAC. We took no measurements, but checked my knee angle when eating out lol. Acceleration seemed similar, but the PAC seemed a bit smoother over rough portions of road. PAC seemed to have a bit more interior height for our bikes, and the stowaway seats were a bonus. Everything else seemed equal, and I can’t think of any factor about the Sienna I preferred. Just my$.02

 

[Rfalcon]

Also, reference the bad, when researching the complaints, it seemed most the issues occurred in 2017 models, and some carried over into 2018. I’m assuming they were bugs in the new format which have been worked out over the years, or have had recall/corrections issued.

 

[SWPacLim]

Now my start/stop system is malfunctioning. Back to the dealer. Even my wife has grown to hate the Pacifica now.

 

[Talhas3]

Once the 2021s come out, wouldn’t that be a really good time to get the 2020’s??

In a couple of months you'll be able to buy a 2020 with AWD. Those buyers will be the beta testers for the system. Rumor has it that there are already many unlabeled 2020 AWD Pacificas on the road being driven by company reps to test them. By the time of the 2021 arrives, they should have a pretty good handle on issues.

 

[Talhas3]

I just traded in my 2018 Toyota Highlander Limited for a 2020 Pacifica Hybrid Limited. Almost bought a 2018 Highlander Hybrid but did not like the price and the way the vehicle drove (plus no tax incentives). I can say the build quality of the Highlander was outstanding, no complaints there. A few design issues, visibility around the outside mirrors was horrible, could not see over or under them when turning (bounced over curbs and medians a few times. The adaptive cruise was agonizingly slow reacting to traffic, steering was vague and tended to wander when you weren't paying attention, and the front seats were hard to get in and out of. All in all, a solid well made SUV with a few annoying quirks. I drove a 2020 Highlander Limited before purchasing my Pacifica and it drove better than the 18 model, mirrors were slightly better so there were improvements made. At that point I had really decided it was time to get a Hybrid and decided to concentrate on the Pacifica.
I first drove a 2020 Pacifica Limited gas model and was impressed with the driveability. It drove a lot like the 2020 Highlander, same get up and go, comparable noise level. I did feel the build quality was not quite as good, but the design and usability was better, a lot of the features worked better (Uconnect, Stow and go, interior storage and room).
When I finally located a new Pacifica Hybrid and got to drive it I was really impressed, it has more get up and go than the gas model, very smooth power and very quiet even when the engine runs. I think it rides better than the gas model, probably due to the weight increase. It handles very well for a van, the seats are comfortable, visibility is really good, and technology is top notch.
Comparing the Highlander to the Pacifica - The Highlander had some annoyances but the build quality was great, the usability and convenience was typical SUV. I liked it but did not love it.
The Pacifica, on the other hand, great design, great usability and space, impressive technology, build quality very good. I love it so far (especially those Hybrid tax incentives), hope I feel the same way 2 years down the road.

What hybrid tax incentives did you get? Did you do the math to see if it’s worth it to pay that much more even with the incentives in place?

 

[Big D]

I'm in Texas, there are several state incentives here but I only qualify for one, which is $2500. The federal incentive is $7500, which I should qualify for. The state incentive I'm pretty sure is taxable, but the federal you get back directly as a refund. My sticker price was roughly $48,000 which was discounted down to roughly $42,000. With incentives my bottom line is roughly $32,000 for the car. At that price it was too good for me to pass up.

 

[pleckerling]

Federal tax rebate of $7500, assuming you have at least that much in federal liabilities for the tax year in which you put the vehicle in service (typically the date of delivery from the dealer). I think the FCA incentives across ICE and hybrid Pacificas are roughly equivalent, possibly better in the ICE models. I think an expectation of $2000-2500 off MSRP is reasonable.

From there, look at the EPA-estimated fuel cost and figure out if your usage is going to exceed or fall short of that estimate for the PacHy (with daily charging and daily driving range under 60 miles, you could be looking at a gasoline cost near zero, while electricity costs can be significantly lower than the equivalent amount of energy in gas, depending on your local electricity rates).

Just speaking ICE vs PacHy, comparing the Monroney stickers yields a fuel savings annually of $800. Again, that’s if you just match the EPA estimate. If you’re able to drive mostly in EV mode, most of the $1850 in annual fuel costs in the ICE Pacifica will disappear for the PacHy, to be replaced by your cost of electricity. If you can use free charging regularly, obviously the electricity cost will go down. I think it’s safe to say that fuel costs (gas+electric) will be at least $2000 cheaper over your first 3 years of operation in a PacHy. So add that to the $7500 federal rebate (if you can take it) and any state incentives and you’re looking at $10,000 in savings with the PacHy. I’m pretty sure that brings it below the cost of a comparable ICE Pacifica as well as below the cost of most 3-row SUVs out there (Pilot, Telluride, Palisade, Explorer, CX-9, Sorrento, etc), barring of course the Highlander Hybrid, which has fantastic fuel economy for the 2020 model year. But the Highlander really is an orange to the Pacifica’s apple.

 

[Talhas3]

Federal tax rebate of $7500, assuming you have at least that much in federal liabilities for the tax year in which you put the vehicle in service (typically the date of delivery from the dealer). I think the FCA incentives across ICE and hybrid Pacificas are roughly equivalent, possibly better in the ICE models. I think an expectation of $2000-2500 off MSRP is reasonable.

From there, look at the EPA-estimated fuel cost and figure out if your usage is going to exceed or fall short of that estimate for the PacHy (with daily charging and daily driving range under 60 miles, you could be looking at a gasoline cost near zero, while electricity costs can be significantly lower than the equivalent amount of energy in gas, depending on your local electricity rates).

Just speaking ICE vs PacHy, comparing the Monroney stickers yields a fuel savings annually of $800. Again, that’s if you just match the EPA estimate. If you’re able to drive mostly in EV mode, most of the $1850 in annual fuel costs in the ICE Pacifica will disappear for the PacHy, to be replaced by your cost of electricity. If you can use free charging regularly, obviously the electricity cost will go down. I think it’s safe to say that fuel costs (gas+electric) will be at least $2000 cheaper over your first 3 years of operation in a PacHy. So add that to the $7500 federal rebate (if you can take it) and any state incentives and you’re looking at $10,000 in savings with the PacHy. I’m pretty sure that brings it below the cost of a comparable ICE Pacifica as well as below the cost of most 3-row SUVs out there (Pilot, Telluride, Palisade, Explorer, CX-9, Sorrento, etc), barring of course the Highlander Hybrid, which has fantastic fuel economy for the 2020 model year. But the Highlander really is an orange to the Pacifica’s apple.

Came across this article and wanted to share it.

Do Hybrid Cars Save You Money? The Answer Will Surprise You

Learn why that hybrid might be costing you more money than you planned.

www.moneysmartguides.com

NJ just passed a bill where the Pacifica hybrid will get an additional $525 roughly as an incentive. Cars like Tesla will get $5000 since they are fully EV

I’m considering between the Touring L and Pacifica hybrid. Don’t need extra things that come after the L trim. Will get the Advanced safety tech package and premium audio group package.

If the numbers come down to the $32k range for the hybrid, then might as well get that model. Haven’t decided yet. Will have to see how much it will be if it’s leased or financed.

 

[Talhas3]

Does Chrysler offer 0% financing on the Pacifica pretty frequently? Anyone know? Or is it very rare?

 

[pleckerling]

Came across this article and wanted to share it.

Do Hybrid Cars Save You Money? The Answer Will Surprise You

Learn why that hybrid might be costing you more money than you planned.

www.moneysmartguides.com

NJ just passed a bill where the Pacifica hybrid will get an additional $525 roughly as an incentive. Cars like Tesla will get $5000 since they are fully EV

I’m considering between the Touring L and Pacifica hybrid. Don’t need extra things that come after the L trim. Will get the Advanced safety tech package and premium audio group package.

If the numbers come down to the $32k range for the hybrid, then might as well get that model. Haven’t decided yet. Will have to see how much it will be if it’s leased or financed.

I come away from that article thinking that it generally makes sense to buy a hybrid, in particular a PHEV/EV where the federal credits haven't yet sunsetted. The lion's share of the extra costs they identify for hybrid ownership are in the purchase premium, which is eliminated (and often turned into a net gain) by the tax credits. So, with a savings at purchase, a savings at the pump and generally equivalent maintenance costs (extra hybrid-related maintenance offset by reduced oil change and brake replacement costs), it's a pretty cut-and-dried argument. There's the no stow-and-go issue (which makes a lot of sense for a lot of folks), but for the Pacifica, the value proposition is compelling.

The whole discussion is a limited-time one, as most manufacturers are committed to moving to a minimum of hybrid-only fleets, with PHEVs and EVs being offered alongside them. So the days of being able to compare a gas Sonata and its hybrid counterpart will end once the only Sonata that can be purchased is a hybrid.

The environmental impact of gas-powered vehicles and the related benefits of hybrids is a whole separate issue, one that is extremely compelling for me personally.

 

[pleckerling]

Does Chrysler offer 0% financing on the Pacifica pretty frequently? Anyone know? Or is it very rare?

I just got an email from my dealer saying the FCA has just announced 0% financing through the summer. Like just a few minutes ago. So, whether it's rare or not, it appears to be happening now.

 

[Talhas3]

I just got an email from my dealer saying the FCA has just announced 0% financing through the summer. Like just a few minutes ago. So, whether it's rare or not, it appears to be happening now.

Is that on all Pacificas or only the ICE models?

 

[pleckerling]

Is that on all Pacificas or only the ICE models?

They didn’t specify. Was a pretty broad announcement, suggesting that it covers everything. It was straight from FCA, so if you call a dealer they should know the specifics.

 

[Talhas3]

I just called a dealership and confirmed that it’s on all Pacificas. Gas and Hybrid.

If I’m leaning towards the Pacifica Hybrid, what should I aim for to get in terms of a discount off the MSRP?

I’ve seen people pay $32k for the hybrid version which is pretty good after considering all the incentives in place.

 

[pleckerling]

A couple of routes to the TrueCar $500 incentive (Sam's/Costco, USAA, etc). There should still be a $1750 FCA incentive going on (maybe it's increased?). So that's $2250. The rest is what you can get from the dealer. I got $1200 but YRMV. Probably can do better if you buy one off the lot, though I'm not sure many dealers will have PacHys sitting on their lots. If factory ordering, you're looking mainly at those I mentioned earlier, plus whatever you can negotiate with the dealership. May be an issue with supply if you're doing a factory order, so be prepared for that possibility. Then, of course, there's the $7500 from the IRS, but only if you owe $7500 in taxes in 2020 (taxes filing in Jan-Apr 2021) AFTER all your other deductions. Fortunately it didn't hurt me in the end, but that's something that I didn't think about until I was filing my taxes this year: your standard deduction, child tax credits, everything like that....make sure there's still $7500 in taxes due after those are deducted or you won't be able to claim the whole credit.