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What's Your Average Fuel Economy (HYBRID ONLY)?

3641 Views 152 Replies 22 Participants Last post by  lacompas
Vehicle Gauge Speedometer Measuring instrument Font

I think average fuel economy is limited to 99 based on the artificial ceiling set by Chrysler. Also not sure if it can be reset or resets with the trip odometer.
And yes I need to clean my instrument panel.
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We can’t really calculate gas mileage in town since most of that sort of driving is electric only. But on our road trips the van consistently gets 32-34 mpg driving the speed limit (65-70).
What does the "Energy Economy" display on yours?
This has to be a non hybrid model, correct?
That's correct, he's running the gas model only not the PACHy.
Calculated at the pump after owning my 18 for almost 5 year 58k km, we plugged all the time:
  • 32 mpg on trips (with roof box)
  • 38 mpg city during winter (Canada, parked outside with Pitman preconditioning)
  • 106 mpg city during summer (includes part of trips)
  • 67 mpg lifetime
How do you get over the 99mpg that's displayed?
If I don't count recharging, then I get about 200 mpg, but that's silly and just depends on your driving/charging habits.
Yeah I was hoping for screenshots of the Hybrid Energy Economy display. That's the only way to work from the same yardstick.
As you should and as it should be discussed.


Facts are short if they shorten the win.

For all but few, this electric is a hobby to be justified.
Few win at hobbies, but everyone says they win.
I appreciate your concession speech.
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From this day forward all reported fuel economy shall be accompanied by a photo of your 2 week drive history.
And a picture ID with you holding it to the camera. Blood sample not necessary.
Cost per mile.
Electric, gas, maintenance, charger install, ALL costs to own.


Everything else is fluffing.
That's true for the whole pie. I'm just looking for this particular slice of cobbler. Sometimes you don't want to eat the whole thing.
Fair enough.
Good luck getting the cook to not add secret ingredients to skew numbers.

So far, that's the problem in the thread.

How about we make it a contest?
A picture of your dash disclosing what the dash says(equal as I can think of) over how many miles.

No rumor, no downhill only, just a screen shot.
Yeah that is the variable that really can define the mpg. If I understand it correctly, it's not user defined on the Economy screen whereas the trip odometer is user defined given that it can be reset.
Here's my info, @M0Par: I'm too lazy to post a photo, but my Average MPG (as shown on the dash) is currently ~85. I have been driving (according to my records and the hybrid page history graph on the radio) for the last 2-3 weeks 99-100% electric-only.

More background: The MPG listed above SHOULD be merely an MPGe calculation according to the EPA: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miles_per_gallon_gasoline_equivalent
So it means I can go 85 miles on 33.7 kWh of electrical energy. This matches the sticker for my van (84 MPGe), but is more than what the van estimates (33 miles on 100% battery which is 16 kWh). (85 miles * 16 kWh / 33.7 kWh = 40.4 miles of range) I can believe that on a full charge I can go 40 miles right now with moderate temperatures, moderate driving, and zero use of heater/AC. That makes sense to me. 84 MPGe sounds pretty good but by comparison, other electric vehicles are much better (Tesla vehicles are 120+ MPGe).

Now my .02: Where Chrysler made it "wrong" is trying to combine ICE/hybrid-mode MPG with electric-only MPGe. They use the same label (MPG) and seem to use a magic conversion (maybe 33.7 kWh = 1 gallon of gas) to combine all into one number: The Hybrid Energy page on the radio shows ICE usage in kWh and the dash efficiency page rating shows everything (including battery) in MPG. This might be convenient, but is misleading and leads people to just view everything as "magic numbers" that don't tell them anything about the efficiency of their vehicle. Unless you carefully drive 100% electric-only like I did for the past 2 weeks, you can't compare your electric-only mode to other vehicles with the current dash and radio info. And unless you drive in 100% ICE/hybrid mode, you can't compare your actual miles per gallon efficiency to other non-plugin vehicles. And the best you can do for calculating your cost per mile (gas and electric combined) is just do an average from one gas tank fill to the next, taking into account gallons, miles, and kWh from all the chargers you used.

I don't really know what would be better, but maybe a cost per mile would be more grounded in reality. Even a rough estimate of local electricity costs and gas prices would be enough to show a nice graph. Maybe the needle/circle graph (like a speedometer or the Energy Economy live chart you have in the photo) could show what you're currently getting, with two sections clearly marked: one for the "normal" ICE/hybrid range of values and one for electric-only. Or maybe just have them be two completely separate metrics with separate charts, stats, etc.
100% agreed. Have a feeling Tesla owners aren't the same demographic. Hopefully they improve this when they deliver the Pacifica EV.
Real word conditions. Yesterday I drove from Philly to Columbus. So I had to drive through some mountainous area and against a slight headwind. I reset the MPG at the start of the trip with 0% on the HV battery so this is true gas mileage. Driving was mostly at 70 mph with a few exceptions.
View attachment 53697
That's a good reading.

Do you know if resetting the MPG resets this Energy Economy? From what I can tell it's aggregate, although over what timeframe I'm uncertain.
I'm not sure why you hang around in the hybrid forum, but let's use some real-world numbers.

We drive our Pacifica ~20,000 miles/year. This is heavily weighted towards short trips. We have had a series of other vehicles similar in size/weight/power to a gas Pacifica, and 20mpg average is being generous. 20,000 miles at 20mpg is 1000 gallons of gas. At $4/gallon, that's $4,000/year for fuel.

With the hybrid we get 30mpg on gas. I figure we do about 6,000 miles/year on hybrid/gas. That's 200 gallons or $800/year for fuel.

On electric we use ~400wH/mile. Our electric rate, all in, is .15/kwH. We do about 14,000 miles/year on electric. That's 5,600kwH/year at a cost of $840.

Total fuel costs for 20,000 miles/year with the hybrid is $1,640/year, versus $4,000 for a gas model. We save $2,360/year.

Further, when we purchased our Hybrid, the out the door price was within $2,000 of the gas model, but we received $7,500 in federal tax rebates. After 5 years of ownership I estimate our total savings will be over $15,000, even accounting for variable gas prices. Not to mention the hybrid version is simply better to drive.
While everyone has to make their own assessment about use case for a hybrid vehicle, the last sentence is really the unheralded reality. It's such a better driving experience that when we drive the gas model it feels downright primitive.
But I assume that when you accelerate you feel the transmission shifting through the gears and hear the fatigue of the engine…
I'm getting fatigued just talking about it.
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When asked why I seek real truths, not esoterics from electric folks;
This scenario is why.
A tainted view based on slightness and that post purchase view wanting to manifest as superiority.

It's not a bad thing.
Not even close to a bad thing.
It is sure nothing to base a purchase on.

People who haven't yet purchased read these posts.
They need to know real, not realities perceived in a way to justify prior purchase.

Miles vs cost seems to be beyond ability because, we're now deep into this thread, and it can't be found as a standard.
Butt feel is asked to be accepted as real.
Gages are asked to be ignored.
Hills are asked to be excused.
Rebates, that used buyers won't get are asked as an offset.
Eventual battery replacement? Like breathing on Mars,...
Be careful not to confuse individual misinterpretation of the standards with lack of implemented standards. There's no doubt the hybrid is far more energy efficient. It's just a matter of individual cost-benefit analysis which is highly subjective, even if the data isn't.

That aside difference between the 9 speed transmission and Pacifica Hybrid transmission called the Si-EVT, can't be over-stated. It is a fully electronically controlled, variable speed transmission that includes two internal electric motors, two lubrication pumps (one mechanical and one electric), an electronic park lock actuator, an auxiliary electronics cooler, an electronic shifter and an electric-only reverse gear. It has a front-wheel-drive electronically-variable transaxle gearbox (i.e.,SI-EVT). It has a myriad of internal and external electronic controllers and a two-motor system running on a three-phase alternating current (AC). The frequency of which determines the motors’ speed, thus controlling torque output. The transmission provides quick and smooth acceleration and is one of the smoothest "CVTs" on the market.
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Just chalk that up to user error.
I can. I've debunked the magic part and can't get anyone to post the fact part.

I don't think it's fair for personal delusions to be presented to folk about to spend $63k.
That's begging the question.

The hybrid is objectively more efficient. It's just a subjective question about whether that added value + the premium experience over the 9 speed gas model is worthwhile. First world problem to be sure.
Objective can be definitive IF the definer wants the facts known.
My guess is pictures of the dash do not support the rhetoric.
Here you go, showing a net savings of $5750 for the average user over 5 years:
Font Wheel Line Material property Parallel
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I conceded early to 30 mile daily commutes being viable.
Exactly. It must be determined by each purchaser. As someone who does 3 * 24= 72 miles per day on 100% electric, it's an absolute bonanza in savings. 💰💰💰

Not to mention a better experience.
Is yours an anomaly of use?
You're 1 in 5,000.

I really miss my electrics. So quiet, so easy. No mess, no fuss.

I still have a dozen 6v batteries here from my ranch carts. I gave the carts away(some golf carts have 1,000 payloads).
I Upgraded to rangers and sportsmans due to more ability.

My next Polaris ranger will be electric.
It's a want I'll pay the premium for.

I'm all for electric.
I'm just not for justifications and self-told-tales being passed on to newbs as gospel instead of gossip.

That's all.
Electric folk post the pics as proof, or I guess it's a guess.
Yes. Definitely an outlier. YMMV.
Actually it isn’t even a continuously variable transmission in the traditional usage of the expression. It’s just called that for marketing reasons. And it actually doesn’t provide quick and smooth shifts as there are no shifts. There is a link to a video floating around here that you may find interesting if you want a basic understanding of how it works.
Right, not literally shifting gears.


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