What's Your Average Fuel Economy (HYBRID ONLY)?

3308 Views 150 Replies 21 Participants Last post by js607191, 2 h ago

M0Par

Discussion Starter · 24 d ago (Edited)

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I think average fuel economy is limited to 99 based on the artificial ceiling set by Chrysler. Also not sure if it can be reset or resets with the trip odometer.
And yes I need to clean my instrument panel.

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lutorm

· #81 · 19 d ago

stop-eject said:
Do you mean that it takes into account the energy gained from regen?

It "takes it into account" in some way, but I don't think in the correct way. When we head downhill, the instant gas mileage that normally displays "99" when coasting actually drops when you go into heavy regen. I think I've had it drop all the way down to ~40s. That makes absolutely no sense. If anything the mpge under regen should be negative. Even if you assume that it displays the negative value as positive, it doesn't match what you'd get based on the kW regen from the ehybrid display and the speed.

To correctly keep track of the average MPGe it would need to keep track of whether energy consumed came from charging the battery instead of from regen, and I don't think it does that.

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M0Par

Discussion Starter · #82 · 18 d ago

lutorm said:
It "takes it into account" in some way, but I don't think in the correct way. When we head downhill, the instant gas mileage that normally displays "99" when coasting actually drops when you go into heavy regen. I think I've had it drop all the way down to ~40s. That makes absolutely no sense. If anything the mpge under regen should be negative. Even if you assume that it displays the negative value as positive, it doesn't match what you'd get based on the kW regen from the ehybrid display and the speed.

To correctly keep track of the average MPGe it would need to keep track of whether energy consumed came from charging the battery instead of from regen, and I don't think it does that.

Consumption is consumption. Why would it keep track of where the energy came from? It doesn't do that when you fill up with gas. MPG doesn't care when you add gas. It could be 2 miles after the last fill up or 200 miles. MPG is just that. It's not a total conservation metric. It's a total consumption metric.

js607191

· #83 · 18 d ago

Ducksface said:
Cost per mile.
Electric, gas, maintenance, charger install, ALL costs to own.

Cost
Per
Mile

Everything else is fluffing.

No. Cost is one factor. reducing energy usage and emissions is the biggest driver for many if not most hybrid users, but hopefully most aren't naive to the realities of cradle to grave energy use and environmental impact. I see this as an investment in the technology with probably slight emissions reduction overall. This will get better with time. That doesn't mean I don't love the fuel savings considering the cost of home electric versus a gallon of gas, and how frequently I enjoy free chargers at various places. I've put 45k on my van in 2 years, and I've saved $1500 in gas if I've saved a nickel.

when it comes to full ev usage, there is too much focus on range and not enough on battery efficiency. Also, a lot of early PHEVs are performance biased luxury options, which means they are just not that efficient. And on top of that, the EV "revolution" is taking focus off the need for more efficient and more available public long range ground transportation. America is still a neanderthal in this area.

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M0Par

Discussion Starter · #84 · 18 d ago

Bested last week's performance.

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Freezin

· #85 · 18 d ago

52.5 is my average since winter. But since it’s warmed up my range has increased to 38 miles. I don’t remember the last time I filled up the gas tank. 👏

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lacompas

· #86 · 18 d ago (Edited)

I think that screen is useless for comparison, since it doesn't have mileage.
Would be better to show your Trip A or B, and mention which model year you have.

I know these trips recycle both average consumption and mileage after a certain amount of miles, so excessive mileages should be discounted.

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M0Par

Discussion Starter · #87 · 18 d ago

lacompas said:
I think that screen is useless for comparison, since it doesn't have mileage.
Would be better to show your Trip A or B, and mention which model year you have.

2017:

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Ducksface

· #88 · 18 d ago

So,
Someone admitted esoterics are important?
That's the strongest post so far.

Thank you.

lacompas

· #89 · 18 d ago

2022 since last fill-up:

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Since ownership in Dec 22, note L/100 km is not representative since it rolls over:

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2

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stop-eject

· #90 · 18 d ago

lutorm said:
It "takes it into account" in some way, but I don't think in the correct way. When we head downhill, the instant gas mileage that normally displays "99" when coasting actually drops when you go into heavy regen. I think I've had it drop all the way down to ~40s. That makes absolutely no sense. If anything the mpge under regen should be negative. Even if you assume that it displays the negative value as positive, it doesn't match what you'd get based on the kW regen from the ehybrid display and the speed.

To correctly keep track of the average MPGe it would need to keep track of whether energy consumed came from charging the battery instead of from regen, and I don't think it does that.

The display shows 99, but the computer behind it counts beyond that number. I agree that it calculates MPGe incorrectly, and IMHO the reason or one of the reasons for it is that the energy from the regen is counted as it was coming from the battery. If you manage to drive 32 miles on a fully charged battery, the meter should read the rated 82MPGe. When it shows 75 MPGe I know it is lying because it would be possible only if the battery had more capacity than its rated for.

M0Par

Discussion Starter · #91 · 18 d ago

The battery is the hub from which all power flows. There's literally no other path. It doesn't dump regen directly into electrical motors.

stop-eject

· #92 · 17 d ago

M0Par said:
The battery is the hub from which all power flows. There's literally no other path. It doesn't dump regen directly into electrical motors.

True, but is it correctly accounted for?
Let's say you charged 10kWh. You drive uphill and spend 5kWh. Then you recover 3 kWh on a steep decline and drive a bit more until these 3kWh are used. Will the MPGe meter be calculated based on 5kWh, 8 kWh or something else?

ThisSuckersElectrical

· #93 · 17 d ago

M0Par

Discussion Starter · #94 · 17 d ago

stop-eject said:
True, but is it correctly accounted for?
Let's say you charged 10kWh. You drive uphill and spend 5kWh. Then you recover 3 kWh on a steep decline and drive a bit more until these 3kWh are used. Will the MPGe meter be calculated based on 5kWh, 8 kWh or something else?

It's based purely on consumption. It doesn't know from where the power is derived between plug in power and recharge power. Give yourself more credit for thinking it through and give the system way less credit for not being that sophisticated.

PacDave

· #95 · 17 d ago

M0Par said:
It's based purely on consumption. It doesn't know from where the power is derived between plug in power and recharge power. Give yourself more credit for thinking it through and give the system way less credit for not being that sophisticated.

That’s true. When the hybrid battery has been exhausted and you are driving in hybrid mode the “electric” miles continue to accrue. The problem is that they could never accrue had you not used any gas. The energy recorded as “electric” miles actually came from energy that was expended by the gasoline engine.

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Ducksface

· #96 · 17 d ago (Edited)

We drive the vehicle hard.
No gas mileage care.
(It's not a hybrid but it does reflect a base and a truth, with no manipulation, pandering, suggestion or ommision, justification, lack of understanding or trust)

What GAS mileage does a hybrid get?
Mine is 22.8 for 4700 miles.

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PacDave

· #97 · 17 d ago

Ducksface said:
We drive the vehicle hard.
No gas mileage care.
(It's not a hybrid but it does reflect a base and a truth, with no manipulation, pandering, suggestion or ommision, justification, lack of understanding or trust)

What GAS mileage does a hybrid get?
Mine is 22.8 for 4700 miles.

And of course that means very little until you give us at least an approximation of highway vs in-town miles.

Ducksface

· #98 · 17 d ago

Just a pic is needed.
It's not a surgical exploration, it's just a glance in the direction of the mileage gage.

Kind of a proof of concept.
The concept being, there is no concept...just a dash pic.

PacDave

· #99 · 17 d ago

Ok. Here is my pic showing MPGe (electric only). Had the van fully charged this morning, reset the MPG average and drove around town today on electric only. If you drive conservatively it’s pretty easy to get 99.9 MPGe (probably closer to 115 MPGe in actuality). If I drive without really thinking about it the average is probably down in the 80s. Also helps that the temperature is about perfect at around 70° today.

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stop-eject

· #100 · 16 d ago

M0Par said:
It's based purely on consumption. It doesn't know from where the power is derived between plug in power and recharge power. Give yourself more credit for thinking it through and give the system way less credit for not being that sophisticated.

It should know the difference, otherwise the EV mode consumption readings are useless.

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