[emilecantin]

Again, geography has a lot to do with needing AWD. I can drive 25 minutes and go from 0ft elevation to 1000ft or higher (and will have gone up and down hundreds of feet during that trip before reaching 1,000ft). 45 minutes and I'm at 3,000ft or higher. I live on a hill that is 500ft elevation, 4 minutes away and I'm at 25ft elevation. It's nothing but hills and mountains around here.

Heck, just leaving my neighborhood there's an 80ft elevation change (downhill to leave the neighborhood). Even my driveway is almost a 10ft drop on the way out!

1cm of snow is enough to have major impact on the roads...and since I live basically next to the cascade and olympic mountains, snow tires and AWD vehicles are a dime a dozen here, yet we still have issues due to terrain.

I'm saying lots of areas have a need for AWD because of the terrain, so it's weird to see people give blanket statements that AWD isn't needed (and snow tires aren't always enough for our weather + terrain, especially when vehicles like the Pacifica weigh 5,000lbs).

As I said above, I don't deny that there's a need for AWD in some situations. If you already have the proper tires and it's still not enough, then yeah, you probably need AWD. The problem is that people think it frees them from the need to get proper tires for the weather. It doesn't.

 

[emilecantin]

I might be a bit extreme about this, but that's because I've seen enough dangerous people in pickups and SUVs thinking they're invincible in the snow because they've got AWD. Their shitty 4-season tires that become hard as hockey pucks below 4°C put everyone around them in danger, including me and my children.

 

[Bond007]

Well, let’s just agree that AWD plus snow tires are the best.

 

[poster123]

Minivan Comparison: 2021 Chrysler Pacifica vs 2021 Toyota Sienna

"While it’s great to finally have some competition in all-wheel-drive minivans and the 2021 Chrysler Pacifica Pinnacle AWD is clearly superior in specific qualities "

So I see many people bashing the Sienna. It’s also understandable since there is just a tiny bit of a bias given this is a Pacifica forum

I bought a 2021 Sienna Platinum AWD with all available options. I have put 3,000 miles on it. I thought about Chrysler Pacifica but after browsing the forums, as I expected, just too many reliability issues.

I had the same concerns as many of you but they ended up being somewhat unfounded.

Let’s start with the biggest one, the 4 cylinders. It’s really a non-issue. The car also has electric motors and has adequate power. You have to drive it to believe it. The drawback is the noise while accelerating but that’s about it. I know people who took their Siennas across the country and were surprised that it didn’t really struggle either when passing other cars or in the mountains.

Non-removable second row seats. They are actually removable but it takes time. There are videos on YouTube. If you need to do this often, yes, not a great option.

Price. It’s expensive. About $60k out the door for mine

Things that I like that may not be unique to Sienna

• 1,500 watts AC outlets x 2. They actually use a hybrid battery. So you can connect a fridge and a microwave when camping.
• Digital mirror. It’s great when you have your car loaded with stuff or if kids are watching cartoons on the rear entertainment system. Since it blocks the view.
• AWD. I wanted it. I’m not putting snow tires for an occasional trip to Tahoe.
• 35-40 mpg real life
• Adaptive cruise control and lane tracing assist. Poor mans autopilot basically
• Apple CarPlay and Android Auto
• It can tow 3,500 lbs

etc.

Then there is the resale value. It is the highest among all of the minivans

As far as sales, good luck getting one. They are pre-sold before they are even built.

just wanted to share my thoughts

 

[Norbert]

Again, resale, its based on msrp. When Pacificas were in abundance you could easily get a Pacifica at almost 20% off msrp. So that factors in on the resale. Whereas Toyota dealers don't discount much. So what if the Pacifica get's 10% less in resale, its started out less. Remove the rear seats? I guess, if taking apart your car is your thing. In that case, I guess the front seats are removable too. What an advantage!

The only thing the Sienna has going for it is the mpg, which is just in this gen and perceived reliability. But this isn't the 80s. Toyota isn't that much ahead of the reliably game. Most cars nowadays are reliable.

 

[SWPacLim]

So I see many people bashing the Sienna. It’s also understandable since there is just a tiny bit of a bias given this is a Pacifica forum

I bought a 2021 Sienna Platinum AWD with all available options. I have put 3,000 miles on it. I thought about Chrysler Pacifica but after browsing the forums, as I expected, just too many reliability issues.

Not bashing the Sienna at all here, I just don't care for many of the design choices they made vs the Pacifica. The reliability concern is 100% reasonable. There is no question it will be more reliable than a Pacifica.

and perceived reliability. But this isn't the 80s. Toyota isn't that much ahead of the reliably game. Most cars nowadays are reliable.

No lol. Having had a bunch of Toyotas and a bunch of Chryslers, my Chryslers have been significantly more problematic, and every statistical measure proves that out too. I dont blame anybody for chosing a Toyota over a Chrysler because of reliability. Toyota always at or near the top, Chrysler always at or near the bottom year after year after year.

 

[PacificaMinivanFan]

There are some features that Pacifica has available on lower trims that Sienna does not (from my understanding of Toyota.com):
o 360 degree camera in Premium and Safety Sphere Group; "Bird's Eye" camera only available on Sienna Platinum.
o 8-way adjustable front passenger seat in Premium and Safety Sphere Group (standard on Limited and up); not available on any Sienna trim level (only 4-way).
o Heated steering wheel only available on Sienna Platinum.
o Rain-sensing windshield wipers only available on Sienna Platinum.
o Third row sunshades only available on Sienna Limited and Platinum.

We have and use all of the above on our '18 Touring L+.

 

[Bond007]

So I see many people bashing the Sienna. It’s also understandable since there is just a tiny bit of a bias given this is a Pacifica forum

I bought a 2021 Sienna Platinum AWD with all available options. I have put 3,000 miles on it. I thought about Chrysler Pacifica but after browsing the forums, as I expected, just too many reliability issues.

I had the same concerns as many of you but they ended up being somewhat unfounded.

Let’s start with the biggest one, the 4 cylinders. It’s really a non-issue. The car also has electric motors and has adequate power. You have to drive it to believe it. The drawback is the noise while accelerating but that’s about it. I know people who took their Siennas across the country and were surprised that it didn’t really struggle either when passing other cars or in the mountains.

Non-removable second row seats. They are actually removable but it takes time. There are videos on YouTube. If you need to do this often, yes, not a great option.

Price. It’s expensive. About $60k out the door for mine

Things that I like that may not be unique to Sienna

• 1,500 watts AC outlets x 2. They actually use a hybrid battery. So you can connect a fridge and a microwave when camping.
• Digital mirror. It’s great when you have your car loaded with stuff or if kids are watching cartoons on the rear entertainment system. Since it blocks the view.
• AWD. I wanted it. I’m not putting snow tires for an occasional trip to Tahoe.
• 35-40 mpg real life
• Adaptive cruise control and lane tracing assist. Poor mans autopilot basically
• Apple CarPlay and Android Auto
• It can tow 3,500 lbs

etc.

Then there is the resale value. It is the highest among all of the minivans

As far as sales, good luck getting one. They are pre-sold before they are even built.

just wanted to share my thoughts

Thank you for sharing your opinion. Glad to know that it is not under powered as perceived by many. But again if the engine makes straining noises / downshifting when you’re accelerating that is not too comforting. Yes I was too skeptical after reading several reviews and some personal experiences. I’m just glad that there are several choices still available in the minivan to suit what everyone’s needs.
Enjoy your minivan life (like ours too).

 

[SWPacLim]

I drove it, its not underpowered around town, but on the highway passing power is much, much weaker than the Pacifica, and that was with just me and the salesman in the van. Load it down with the whole family and all our stuff and pull out to pass a truck on an up grade in the mountains...the Pacifica is slow enough in that situation.

 

[poster123]

There are some features that Pacifica has available on lower trims that Sienna does not (from my understanding of Toyota.com):
o 360 degree camera in Premium and Safety Sphere Group; "Bird's Eye" camera only available on Sienna Platinum.
o 8-way adjustable front passenger seat in Premium and Safety Sphere Group (standard on Limited and up); not available on any Sienna trim level (only 4-way).
o Heated steering wheel only available on Sienna Platinum.
o Rain-sensing windshield wipers only available on Sienna Platinum.
o Third row sunshades only available on Sienna Limited and Platinum.

We have and use all of the above on our '18 Touring L+.

Yes. All of this is true. That’s why I had to go with the platinum trim.

 

[SWPacLim]

I will say this, the styling of the Sienna is growing on me a lot. I see a good many of them around and one of my neighbor has one, and they're sharp.

 

[Randy.BC]

So I see many people bashing the Sienna. It’s also understandable since there is just a tiny bit of a bias given this is a Pacifica forum

I bought a 2021 Sienna Platinum AWD with all available options. I have put 3,000 miles on it. I thought about Chrysler Pacifica but after browsing the forums, as I expected, just too many reliability issues.

I had the same concerns as many of you but they ended up being somewhat unfounded.

Let’s start with the biggest one, the 4 cylinders. It’s really a non-issue. The car also has electric motors and has adequate power. You have to drive it to believe it. The drawback is the noise while accelerating but that’s about it. I know people who took their Siennas across the country and were surprised that it didn’t really struggle either when passing other cars or in the mountains.

Non-removable second row seats. They are actually removable but it takes time. There are videos on YouTube. If you need to do this often, yes, not a great option.

Price. It’s expensive. About $60k out the door for mine

Things that I like that may not be unique to Sienna

• 1,500 watts AC outlets x 2. They actually use a hybrid battery. So you can connect a fridge and a microwave when camping.
• Digital mirror. It’s great when you have your car loaded with stuff or if kids are watching cartoons on the rear entertainment system. Since it blocks the view.
• AWD. I wanted it. I’m not putting snow tires for an occasional trip to Tahoe.
• 35-40 mpg real life
• Adaptive cruise control and lane tracing assist. Poor mans autopilot basically
• Apple CarPlay and Android Auto
• It can tow 3,500 lbs

etc.

Then there is the resale value. It is the highest among all of the minivans

As far as sales, good luck getting one. They are pre-sold before they are even built.

just wanted to share my thoughts

I don't know why some people are so defensive about their brands. It's just a van at the end of the day!
"Congrats on your purchase and I hope you enjoy it!" should be a shortcut on our keyboards.
I think the Sienna is great -- have lots of wonderful adventures!

 

[PacificaMinivanFan]

Personally, I'd love to own a new Sienna Platinum, but the second row seats that are not easily removable. Better yet would be a Sienna XLE with the ability to add an option package that includes heated steering wheel and rain-sensing wipers (can only get those items on a Platinum).

 

[harryn]

Things that I like that may not be unique to Sienna

• 1,500 watts AC outlets x 2. They actually use a hybrid battery. So you can connect a fridge and a microwave when camping.
• Digital mirror. It’s great when you have your car loaded with stuff or if kids are watching cartoons on the rear entertainment system. Since it blocks the view.
• AWD. I wanted it. I’m not putting snow tires for an occasional trip to Tahoe.
• Adaptive cruise control and lane tracing assist. Poor mans autopilot basically
• 
  
• It can tow 3,500 lbs

As much as I can't stand the idea of buying a Toyota, these exact features are exactly why my daughter and her family will most likely buy one.

It is astounding that these features are not built into the Pacifica hybrid regardless of the trim level.

 

[Randy.BC]

As much as I can't stand the idea of buying a Toyota, these exact features are exactly why my daughter and her family will most likely buy one.

It is astounding that these features are not built into the Pacifica hybrid regardless of the trim level.

Why can't you stand the idea of buying a Toyota?
My personal view is that we should buy the things that work for our needs as consumers. No need to be brand-loyal when you can just be loyal to yourself - what do you need from the vehicle? Get the one that ticks the most boxes for you.

 

[Bond007]

As much as I can't stand the idea of buying a Toyota, these exact features are exactly why my daughter and her family will most likely buy one.

It is astounding that these features are not built into the Pacifica hybrid regardless of the trim level.

So what’s is missing in Pacifica…?
It has AWD, adaptive cruise, lane keeping, etc. It doesn’t need digital mirror when videos are being played since there’s no obstruction of view by screen, and it can tow the same. All you need is an extra AC outlet and a Fridge. Right?

 

[harryn]

Why can't you stand the idea of buying a Toyota?
My personal view is that we should buy the things that work for our needs as consumers. No need to be brand-loyal when you can just be loyal to yourself - what do you need from the vehicle? Get the one that ticks the most boxes for you.

Few companies have done more damage to the economy of North America than Toyota.

Just as an example, between them and Nissan / Honda, in the 1970s and 80s, they dumped vehicles into the North America market - wiping out millions of jobs, $ Billions from the mfg industry, and added massively to the trade deficit. Meanwhile, unfair trade practices blocked exporting cars and other products to Japan at the request of firms like Toyota.

Even today they are a massive force in the trade deficit. Instead of importing parts from Japan though, a lot of it is from China.

People who blindly buy products without thinking about the economic impact on the US and North America are ---- well I won't say it.

 

[harryn]

So what’s is missing in Pacifica…?
It has AWD, adaptive cruise, lane keeping, etc. It doesn’t need digital mirror when videos are being played since there’s no obstruction of view by screen, and it can tow the same. All you need is an extra AC outlet and a Fridge. Right?

Obviously not if you read what I wrote.

The weather conditions in BC / PNW are completely different than in the California central valley and AZ.

 

[SWPacLim]

Few companies have done more damage to the economy of North America than Toyota.

Just as an example, between them and Nissan / Honda, in the 1970s and 80s, they dumped vehicles into the North America market - wiping out millions of jobs, $ Billions from the mfg industry, and added massively to the trade deficit. Meanwhile, unfair trade practices blocked exporting cars and other products to Japan at the request of firms like Toyota.

Even today they are a massive force in the trade deficit. Instead of importing parts from Japan though, a lot of it is from China.

As someone who is a longtime Toyota customer (well, I was until this year) there is a lot of truth to this. Toyota is a company that has a long history of only looking out for themselves, they are the largest lobbyist in the US among car companies for instance, and I don't want to get political but their agenda they lobby for is extremely right wing. They are basically signle handledly trying to stop the US moves toward EV cars for instance, because if you havent noticed they are way behind in EV tech. One could just go on and on.

There are many examples of other car companies that have made moves to make all cars better, making patents for safety designs open (Mercedes is famous for that as is Volvo) so other carmakers can adopt their inventions. Not Toyota.

Toyota is not a nice company. Would that stop be from buying a Toyota? No, I'm not trying to save the world with my vehicle purchases, but I totally get it.

 

[Norbert]

Oh please guys. If you ever go to siennachat.com you'll see endless, endless posts about how crappy the Pacifica/Chrysler is. You'd think that as soon as the warranty expired that the Pacifica would just break down and explode. Or that its a rolling hunk of junk. All this to make their choice of sienna look better. Endless endless apologies for the sienna shortcomings. The only thing they can say though it that they can have a hybrid with AWD.

But you want us to be different here?