Hi all, our family recently purchased a 2019 PacHy (or first hybrid of anykind) and I understand that the manual states regular unleaded is the required/recommend fuel type, however, in talking with a few other hybrid owners (Fusion and Prius) they fill up with premium. I don’t believe they are required to, but both said it is better on the engine? What do you fill up with and do you notice any difference if you fill up with premium? We are still on our first tank of gas from the dealer with about 600 miles on the vehicle and will be filling up soon so I wanted to kick the question out there.
Premium vs Regular unleaded
SteePacHy
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Yes, and ethanol also degrades more rapidly than non-ethanol gasoline.
If you know you're not going to use the ICE for an extended time (on any vehicle, I suppose), the 'uncharge' for premium (and preferably non-ehtanol, at that) wouldn't seem all that great over an extended period of time, just for the peace of mind.
But, like I said, anyone can put whatever they want into their gas tank (including a boat, which would seem even worse since the tank isn't sealed as well as a car) and let it sit there for an extended period of time. It will most probably be fine when the ICE is called upon to run.
The Volt also briefly runs the ICE periodically when it hasn't ran over a period of time.
And, yet...
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For 60 cent premium price, you could buy quite a bit of STA-BIL, if disuse is a concern.
$.60 x 15 (gallons) = $9.00
Sta-Bil Ethanol Treatment = $8.98 (Home Depot)
Kind of a toss-up but worth considering.
Just so members don't go down the wrong path, Sta-Bil Ethanol Treatment is not the correct product for the Pacifica. The Ethanol Treatment is for small engines that typically do not do well with ethanol. The Pacifica is designed to run on up to 15% ethanol. The correct Sta-Bil product is the Fuel Stabilizer which has the word Storage on the label.
The price is the same as the Ethanol Treatment which is labeled 360 Performance.
BTW, if you buy the 32oz for $12.98 instead of the 8oz bottle for $8.98 at Home Depot than the price of the treatment is about 17 cents per gallon (depending on your sales tax). But even with the 8oz bottle pricing, if I was concerned about long term storage, I would be more confident in the Sta-Bil product actually extending the shelf life of regular gasoline versus using premium gas. There is anecdotal information from individuals that claim premium lasts longer but of the many articles I've read on regular versus premium, none mention longer shelf life as an advantage for premium gas.
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The 32 oz. bottle is $8.88 at Walmart. It is designed to treat 80 gallons.
With so many Pachy owners stating that they go months without refueling, wouldn't it be better if Stabil was added to the fuel to prevent it from becoming stale (varnish)?
Yes the Pachy has a refresh mode but that just burns the old fuel in the injectors and puts the same old fuel back in them from the tank. Just a thought.
Yes the Pachy has a refresh mode but that just burns the old fuel in the injectors and puts the same old fuel back in them from the tank. Just a thought.
I agree. You’re not gonna get stale gas in the PacHy unless you don’t drive it for a year or something ridiculous like that. The PacHy’s onboard computer will force the gas to be used before it ever gets ‘stale’.
Honestly, I’ve never had a problem with stale gas in any vehicle I’ve ever owned. And we have a convertible that gets driven very little through the winter. The only problems I’ve ever had are with my little 2-cycle garden tools...probably because they have such small orifices in the carburetor.
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19 Posts
In Europe the "regular" gas is 95 octane (there is no step below), the premium 98 or even 100. I fill always 95 octane. BUT I noted that with 98 octane gas the mileage was not so good as with 95' and could not feel significant difference in engine power or drive comfort.
Szabolcs
Szabolcs
KSzab,
That is misleading.
In Europe, gas stations describe different grades of gasoline based on their RON rating. It is typical to have 100, 99, 98, 97 or 95 RON with prices varying accordingly. In the States the descriptions look a lot like RON, but they are not.
In the United States gas stations describe the grades of gasoline based on the Pump Octane Number (PON). That number is the average between RON and MON (RON + MON/2). This causes confusion.
If a fuel is 95 RON and 87 MON then it will be 91 PON -> 91 PUMP
That is misleading.
In Europe, gas stations describe different grades of gasoline based on their RON rating. It is typical to have 100, 99, 98, 97 or 95 RON with prices varying accordingly. In the States the descriptions look a lot like RON, but they are not.
In the United States gas stations describe the grades of gasoline based on the Pump Octane Number (PON). That number is the average between RON and MON (RON + MON/2). This causes confusion.
If a fuel is 95 RON and 87 MON then it will be 91 PON -> 91 PUMP
Wow. That’s very informative and interesting. What do RON and MON stand for? Expansion???
I guess it’s something like the British used to ridicule American cars for their perceived fuel inefficiency when comparing miles per gallon. It turns out their gallon is much bigger than American gallon, and that accounts for a big part of the discrepancy.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
No, it has nothing to do with expansion. You would have to be a petroleum engineer to understand it in totality, but a good explanation as you will find is on Wikipedia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating
Bottom line:
Premium and Regular are names given by marketing people to different fuels with different octanes.
Nothing more.
Octane is a measure of pre-igniition resistance.
Nothing more.
Premium is not a longer lasting fuel, it does not indicate how long it will stay "fresh" (whatever that means)
Premium only means that the fuel resists Pre-ignition (knock, or ping) in higher compression engines.
Some fuels ARE better than others (top tier for example), but you cannot tell which ones they are by whether they are called premium or regular.
Most engines actually run better and more efficiently on regular than they do 91 or 93 octane.
High compression engines need higher octane. The Pacifica's Pentastar V6 is not one of them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating
Bottom line:
Premium and Regular are names given by marketing people to different fuels with different octanes.
Nothing more.
Octane is a measure of pre-igniition resistance.
Nothing more.
Premium is not a longer lasting fuel, it does not indicate how long it will stay "fresh" (whatever that means)
Premium only means that the fuel resists Pre-ignition (knock, or ping) in higher compression engines.
Some fuels ARE better than others (top tier for example), but you cannot tell which ones they are by whether they are called premium or regular.
Most engines actually run better and more efficiently on regular than they do 91 or 93 octane.
High compression engines need higher octane. The Pacifica's Pentastar V6 is not one of them.
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I spent 32 years in R&D for a major oil company--much of it in fuel research. I would agree with pretty much everything you say, but I have never seen evidence that engines run better and more efficiently on regular. Also, regular and premium are more than marketing labels, they refer to octane rating, and are industry standard designations. Finally, you can see which retailers offer Top Tier gasoline at the link below.
https://www.consumerreports.org/car-maintenance/study-shows-top-tier-gasoline-worth-extra-price/
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400 Posts
I guess now I am the stickler. The Pachy does have a high compression engine.
The need for higher octane as a function of compression ratio is now old news, out of date and no longer true as a rule. It was true for manifold injection and carburated engines, but not true for direct injection engines. The the Pacifica hybrid engine is direct injected as is my son's Mazda 6 and many other cars on the road today. Direct injection is the initiation of injection of fuel into the combustion chamber directly during compression, not during intake. It allows combustion to proceed more as a deflagration torching rather than an explosion. So the fuel/air mix is not compressed together and so not subject to hot spot pre-ignition that causes detonation pinging and engine damage. If you want a high performing engine, direct injection is the way to go. It allows much higher compression ratios and by laws of thermodynamics, this results in much higher brake efficiency of the engine. If the car is direct injected, it will have a high compression ratio and get way better gas mileage. Without direct injection, the low 10s compression ratio is about as much as you can do without backing off timing and/or needing high octane. Of course, the direct injected engine requires a much higher fuel pressure at injection, so it has only become common recently. But the benefits are astounding.
Examples:
Honda Fit 2009 CR 10.4, MPG 27/33
Honda Fit 2019 CR 11.5, MPG 33/40
Mazda 6 2015 CR 13, MPG 26/38
Dodge Challenger 2016 R/T 5.7L HEMI, CR 10.5, MPG 16/25 (Requires premium to avoid considerable ign. retard and carbon buildup.)
Pachy CR 12.5
Guess which ones are direct injected.
The dramatic difference is really evident in two of our cars. The dinky 1.5L engine in our 2009 ultra-low emission dinky Honda Fit kicks down and revs up to go over an overpass. With it's light weight, low drag and small engine, you would think it would get better gas mileage than our 2015 Mazda 6 full size car with its 2.5L engine, great rear seat leg room, much heavier weight and much more powerful feel and ride. But no. Even in the city, the Mazda blows away the Honda Fit in our experience. The real difference is not octane. Both have been using 87 octane for all their fill-ups. It is DIRECT INJECTION.
So if you want to waste money and get nothing for it as many have pointed out here. Buy premium gas, knowing that your Pachy simply cannot benefit from it.
Otherwise, the suggestion to get your gas at a reliable, high volume, high quality source was good advice. Also run thru a complete tank of gas once every couple of months and throw down a good fuel injector/upper cyl treatment every few tanks. I use Lucas and buy it by the gallon.
No, the Pacifica Pentastar engine is not Direct Injected (DI).
It was designed in, but that technology is still on the shelf.
The compression ratios are different on the gas v hybrid engines, but no DI.
Also, even with a compression ratio of 12.5:1, it is still engineered for 87 octane.
It was designed in, but that technology is still on the shelf.
The compression ratios are different on the gas v hybrid engines, but no DI.
Also, even with a compression ratio of 12.5:1, it is still engineered for 87 octane.
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